06/2008 Winner: Heir to the Empire by Timothy Zahn

[Solai]

http://www.galacticawatercooler.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/heir.jpg

...It's five years after Return of the Jedi: the Rebel Alliance has destroyed the Death Star, defeated Darth Vader and the Emperor, and driven out the remnants of the old Imperial Starfleet to a distant corner of the galaxy...

So begins the description of the highly acclaimed, Heir to the Empire. Please share your thoughts, reactions and reviews of the book here.

This thread will contain spoilers. If you have not finished the book, proceed at your own risk

[Casilda]

This should be interesting :)
Though I went to get the book at the library today, and their copy was missing! So now I have to wait for another library to send it... alas.

[GalaxyRanger]

Can we discuss the whole trilogy or just Heir?

[Solai]

Can we discuss the whole trilogy or just Heir?

Good question GR...I would say just Heir. I suspect people are going to start campaigning for the next books in the series.

[GalaxyRanger]

Good question GR...I would say just Heir. I suspect people are going to start campaigning for the next books in the series.

I'm certain about that. Anyone who finishes Heir is bound to pick up the other two books.

Well, there's not much to say about Heir, it sets up the best story of the EU in my mind. What a pity it wasn't made into movies.

[TighFighter]

Good question GR...I would say just Heir. I suspect people are going to start campaigning for the next books in the series.

Well it's kind of a no brainier to finish the series off. A few of us were toying around with starting SW book club and this was going to be the first SW series to read.

I've read the first few chapters. I forgot what an excellent writter Zahn is. I love the opening scene with Thrawn in his second command Chamber and Luke's final encounter with Obi-Wan.

[GalaxyRanger]

I've read the first few chapters. I forgot what an excellent writter Zahn is. I love the opening scene with Thrawn in his second command Chamber and Luke's final encounter with Obi-Wan.

Oh hell yeah, Thrawn is one of the best characters in the entire Star Wars universe. And in a way, he's a much more menacing figure than Vader or the Emperor because Thrawn knows what he's doing.

[Solai]

I'm certain about that. Anyone who finishes Heir is bound to pick up the other two books.

Well, there's not much to say about Heir, it sets up the best story of the EU in my mind. What a pity it wasn't made into movies.

GR, I agree and disagree. People voted on this book, not the trilogy. Asking someone to read 600-900 pages is a big ask.

I recommend starting a "Thrawn Trilogy" thread over in the open group read section, that way people who want to read all three can discuss the series there, and those who want to participate in the discussion but don't want to be spoiled can talk in here.

Make sense?

[ThotFullGuy]

GR, I agree and disagree. People voted on this book, not the trilogy. Asking someone to read 600-900 pages is a big ask.

I recommend starting a "Thrawn Trilogy" thread over in the open group read section, that way people who want to read all three can discuss the series there, and those who want to participate in the discussion but don't want to be spoiled can talk in here.

Make sense?

Good idea. Personally I'm planning to re-read the whole trilogy anyway.
So me, Wally and the Beave can at least discuss the whole thing.

[GalaxyRanger]

GR, I agree and disagree. People voted on this book, not the trilogy. Asking someone to read 600-900 pages is a big ask.

All I meant was that I'm sure many people who finish Heir are likely to go on reading the other two books because they'll be intrigued by the story and will want to know what happens next. It was a general statement, not actually pertaining to how we shoudl handle discussion in this thread.


I recommend starting a "Thrawn Trilogy" thread over in the open group read section

There already exists such a thread over there and I'd ecourage everybody to talk there too!

[Solai]

There already exists such a thread over there and I'd ecourage everybody to talk there too!

Here is the link (http://forum.galacticwatercooler.com/showthread.php?p=16544) for everyone's convienence.

[Leah]

Here is the link (http://forum.galacticwatercooler.com/showthread.php?p=16544) for everyone's convienence.

I read the books when they first came out in the 90s. I am not sure how much I remember from then. I wish I knew we were going to do this book. I would have done my "homework" before going back to work.

[ThotFullGuy]

I read the books when they first came out in the 90s. I am not sure how much I remember from then. I wish I knew we were going to do this book. I would have done my "homework" before going back to work.

Just assign the book for your class to read. That will give you an excuse to re-read them. :D

[Rowan]

YAY!!!! I lurve the Thrawn books. I mean how many amazing characters came out of this book/series? Mara Jade, Talon Karrde, Thrawn, Gilad Pellaeon, The Noghri, the Vornskrs, the Ysalamiri, the Chiss....so many more! So many characters that will fill out the EU in all of the coming books etc.

I seriously need to dig this book back out and re-love it.

[Leah]

Just assign the book for your class to read. That will give you an excuse to re-read them. :D

I read Ender's Game with a class when I taught English. Wow how could I fit it into History? Well it did happen a long long time ago. ;)

[Darth_Revan_Rules]

hey all, new here, been listening to the podcast since about a month before Season 4 started


anyways to the topic at hand



I just finished the first of the trilogy last night, I haven't read it before which is why I'm choosing to post here. I've gotta say I really did enjoy it, and I'm looking forward to starting the second hopefully tomorrow night.


It makes me wonder how the movies would have turned out if Lucas had decided to make these 3 movies right after the original trilogy or even a few year gap and used the original actors, it could have been great. Now I know everyone here probably knows a ton more about Mara Jade than I do at this point but I really did like her character here, she seems pardon the language, a real bad ass haha.

Thrawn so far to me appears to be a great villain, I actually liked how the book ended with him pulling out rather than sending everything in to be slaughtered, which before he took over is exactly what they would have done, but talk about the luck of Lando just 'happening' to remember the codes to the mole miners out there? Oh well it is Star Wars I can suspend belief there a bit.


Looking forward to learning more about Mara, what happens to Leia, and more about how Luke will eventually confront C'boath .

[ol_whatsername]

hey all, new here, been listening to the podcast since about a month before Season 4 started


anyways to the topic at hand



I just finished the first of the trilogy last night, I haven't read it before which is why I'm choosing to post here. I've gotta say I really did enjoy it, and I'm looking forward to starting the second hopefully tomorrow night.


It makes me wonder how the movies would have turned out if Lucas had decided to make these 3 movies right after the original trilogy or even a few year gap and used the original actors, it could have been great. Now I know everyone here probably knows a ton more about Mara Jade than I do at this point but I really did like her character here, she seems pardon the language, a real bad ass haha.

Thrawn so far to me appears to be a great villain, I actually liked how the book ended with him pulling out rather than sending everything in to be slaughtered, which before he took over is exactly what they would have done, but talk about the luck of Lando just 'happening' to remember the codes to the mole miners out there? Oh well it is Star Wars I can suspend belief there a bit.


Looking forward to learning more about Mara, what happens to Leia, and more about how Luke will eventually confront C'boath .

Mara is my absolute favorite SW character. Heir to the Empire was the first SW novel I read and after spending years promising myself I wouldn't get caught up in the novels Mara Jade had me hooked. I had to keep reading just to see more Mara Jade.

[Fenatic]

*Spoiler for the end of Heir to the Empire*


Thrawn so far to me appears to be a great villain, I actually liked how the book ended with him pulling out rather than sending everything in to be slaughtered, which before he took over is exactly what they would have done, but talk about the luck of Lando just 'happening' to remember the codes to the mole miners out there? Oh well it is Star Wars I can suspend belief there a bit.

Think about it this way, this time the New Republic won by being lucky. Thrawn knows this, and is smart enough to realize that next time, they wont be. Thats the kind of smart Thrawn is, calculating, careful, and long term thinking.

P.S. What is the spoiler policy for the book's own thread?

[Pike]

P.S. What is the spoiler policy for the book's own thread?

Good question. I think in the past that the thread was spoiler-understood.

But the fact that this is a trilogy (that I have yet to read) makes me a bit over-cautious, so I spoiler-quoted the questionable bits. Sorry if that was overkill.

[Darth_Revan_Rules]

I'm sorry guys I assumed that spoilers were okay :(

[Pike]

I'm sorry guys I assumed that spoilers were okay :(

No, spoilers for this book are cool (I think. Right folks?)

I couldn't tell if you were spoiling the rest of the trilogy, though.

[Solai]

This thread will contain spoilers. If you have not finished the book, proceed at your own risk

Thread is for discussing the book once you have completed it...coming in here before is asking for trouble.

[TighFighter]

Luke and Leia finally go all the way.

[Archtaku]

Nice, it's been a while since I've read this series but I'm up for a re-read.

[Konrad]

Whoa.
Bloody weird... I just checked this out from the library a few days ago, wasn't paying attention to this at all.

[GeneralZod]

Whoa.
Bloody weird... I just checked this out from the library a few days ago, wasn't paying attention to this at all.

Me too, just finished the trilogy and loved it. I then went to the library and saw the vast amount of star wars universe books. I picked up a couple, but I'm getting the impression they're not written as well as Zahn's books. Anyone out there recommending any books that will hold up for an adult reader?

[Leon Kensington]

Okay, I have a question for everyone:

Would you like to see a Thrawn Trilogy movie series if it was done like Clone Wars, but with the original voices of Mark Hamill, Carry Fisher, Harrison Ford, Billy Dees, etc?

[Fenatic]

Me too, just finished the trilogy and loved it. I then went to the library and saw the vast amount of star wars universe books. I picked up a couple, but I'm getting the impression they're not written as well as Zahn's books. Anyone out there recommending any books that will hold up for an adult reader?
The easy answer to this is the other Timmothy Zahn Star Wars books. If you liked these I would definitly recomend the The Hand of Thrawn duology (Specter of the Past and Vision of the Future. It picks up a few years after these books end, and has a lot of the same characters. Both are really good.

[Darth_Revan_Rules]

No, spoilers for this book are cool (I think. Right folks?)

I couldn't tell if you were spoiling the rest of the trilogy, though.

ah okay, well I've only read the first one but am planning to start the second this weekend :p

[TighFighter]

Me too, just finished the trilogy and loved it. I then went to the library and saw the vast amount of star wars universe books. I picked up a couple, but I'm getting the impression they're not written as well as Zahn's books. Anyone out there recommending any books that will hold up for an adult reader?

Here's (http://forum.galacticwatercooler.com/showthread.php?t=2407) a list I made a few months ago. Pretty much tells you what SW books are worth reading and which to skip.

[Default Prophet]

I read the comic version of this. Twas cool.

[Tesseract]

YAY!!!! I lurve the Thrawn books. I mean how many amazing characters came out of this book/series? Mara Jade, Talon Karrde, Thrawn, Gilad Pellaeon, The Noghri, the Vornskrs, the Ysalamiri, the Chiss....so many more! So many characters that will fill out the EU in all of the coming books etc.
.

Come to think of it, Zahn put together the most interesting non-movie new characters to the Star Wars universe (my favorites were Mara Jade, Thrawn and Winter). The Noghri felt like menacing Ewoks to me, which was very cool. I was half-hoping to see some Noghri around Vader when Episode 3 rolled along (and maybe a young Thrawn walkthrough, but hey, a girl can dream, right?)

I've just read the first few chapters. I remember reading the part about Luke's liking for hot chocolate. I think it's in keeping with Luke's character that he likes hot chocolate :) Leia feels the stirrings of the twins for the first time at the intro, and the busy-ness of her and Han's jobs keeping them apart for the most part during their marriage.

Thanks for picking this for the group read!

[Tesseract]

Okay, I have a question for everyone:

Would you like to see a Thrawn Trilogy movie series if it was done like Clone Wars, but with the original voices of Mark Hamill, Carry Fisher, Harrison Ford, Billy Dees, etc?

I think that's the best option right now - if the setting for the books is five years after Endor, and the real-life ages of the actors is twenty (plus) years after the movies, that makes for a really oold Princess Leia, and crinkly Han and Luke, huh? :)

What I wouldn't give to see who they'd get to pick to be Mara though. :cool:


from Fenatic
The easy answer to this is the other Timothy Zahn Star Wars books. If you liked these I would definitly recomend the The Hand of Thrawn duology (Specter of the Past and Vision of the Future. It picks up a few years after these books end, and has a lot of the same characters. Both are really good.

I've read a lot of SW books and I still think everything that Timothy Zahn wrote for this universe tops anyone else so far. I highly recommend the Hand of Thrawn series.

[Casilda]

OK So I'm writing this before I read the rest of the thread, as I just finished Heir.

It was much better than I expected. You might even say, I liked it.

The quality of writing was higher, the engagement with the characters, the plot... I'll admit, I was expecting it to suck (ducking, I know) - but I was pleasantly surprised. I don't know how Zahn did it (and I should, since I study books), but he really made those characters from the screen even more engaging on the page.

I'm really very interested in Mara Jade's character, so I've gone ahead and am getting the other 2 books in the Trilogy from the library.

Things I really liked about the book:
1. Luke actually seemed like a real character, much less wooden than he did in the movies.
2. Mara Jade is awesome. I don't know what happens with her (well I kind of do, my brother read a bunch of SW books when we were younger), but she is just awesome.
3. I like Kashyyk, now I understand why people were so excited about it appearing in Episode 3.
4. Karrde's fascinating. I wonder what happens with him? (don't tell me!!)
5. At first the treatment of Leia was kind of annoying, but it really drove home after the first half or so of the book the danger she is in, and Han's softening (their kids, it's so cute)

Other comments (not particularly negative ones)
1. Thrawn wasn't as evil as I was expecting
2. With the prequels some of the stuff going on just seems... weird. I can't put my finger on it yet, maybe reading the other books will help me flesh it out.
3. Joruus just gets on my nerves. If I were Thrawn, I'd say screw it and just kill him. But then again, I'm not Thrawn. Evidently I'm more like Vader ;)

And Lando is still sketchy.

[Casilda]

It makes me wonder how the movies would have turned out if Lucas had decided to make these 3 movies right after the original trilogy or even a few year gap and used the original actors, it could have been great. Now I know everyone here probably knows a ton more about Mara Jade than I do at this point but I really did like her character here, she seems pardon the language, a real bad ass haha.

She does seem all kinds of wonderful :) And I do think it would have been interesting to us hard-core people, but it wouldn't have had the same draw as the OT. But I totally would have seen them multiple times in the theater...


Thrawn so far to me appears to be a great villain, I actually liked how the book ended with him pulling out rather than sending everything in to be slaughtered, which before he took over is exactly what they would have done, but talk about the luck of Lando just 'happening' to remember the codes to the mole miners out there? Oh well it is Star Wars I can suspend belief there a bit.

I like Thrawn as a character, I just don't see him as much as a villain. He strikes me as dedicated, intelligent, devious, and a good leader. Wise, even. But those characteristics aren't necessarily "villain" characteristics for me. I guess I'm just used to Star Wars villains being overdrawn... you know, Big Dark Helmet, breathing apparatus, evil glint in the eye, cackles, cloaks, etc.


Looking forward to learning more about Mara, what happens to Leia, and more about how Luke will eventually confront C'boath .
I'm asking the same questions...


Would you like to see a Thrawn Trilogy movie series if it was done like Clone Wars, but with the original voices of Mark Hamill, Carry Fisher, Harrison Ford, Billy Dees, etc?

Yes.

[GalaxyRanger]

I'm really very interested in Mara Jade's character, so I've gone ahead and am getting the other 2 books in the Trilogy from the library.

See, Pike, that's what I meant: once someone has read the first book, they are sure as hell gonna wanna get the other two as well!

Honestly, I'm glad you're enjoying it!

[Casilda]

See, Pike, that's what I meant: once someone has read the first book, they are sure as hell gonna wanna get the other two as well!

Honestly, I'm glad you're enjoying it!

Me too.

That said - I wouldn't want to wait for the 'book of the month' bit to read them. I know I can read very quickly and I plow through books, but I'm OK not having the other two parts be official Book Club books.

[Erised]

Hello! (My first post on the GWC forums) Anywho...!

I'm a huge Zahn fan and would love to reread HTTE (along with the rest of the Thrawn Trilogy). Looking forward to all the discussion.

[Casilda]

Welcome, Erised!

(of mirror fame, may I ask?)

You should head on over and introduce yourself in our Unofficial Introduction Thread (http://forum.galacticwatercooler.com/showthread.php?t=39).

I'm still sitting on the library to get me the other 2 books in the Thrawn trilogy... though if you want to talk about Heir, hey! I finished it! This weekend! Talk to me about books!

(does that punctuation adequately express my enthusiasm?)

[Erised]

Welcome, Erised!

(of mirror fame, may I ask?)

Hi, Casilda! (My username is definitely of mirror fame! Always great to see fellow HP fans.)

Thank you for the welcome & the heads up. :) I was looking for a intro thread so I definitely appreciate the link.

Congrats on finishing HTTE! I think it's a great summer read. What did you think about the ysalamir? Interesting concept of a living organism repelling the Force. I'm not one for the midichlorian explaination so I live more in the renaissance before the prequels. ;)

Good luck getting the rest of the books!

[Keara]

Joruus just gets on my nerves. If I were Thrawn, I'd say screw it and just kill him. But then again, I'm not Thrawn. Evidently I'm more like Vader ;)

Casilda, I agreed with everything you wrote, but I laughed out loud at this, because I truly identified with your comment "Evidently I'm more like Vader." Me too. Jorus would have been a Noghri snack in short order if I had been in charge.